I received an email comment last night from the lady who courageously videotaped many police abuses during the National Police Week festivities. It is comment # 72 on the prior blog entry. I think it deserves more visibility, so I am highlighting it here. She mentions, ”Any input, help, support or even a few kind words at this point, would be appreciated.” Her email address is inthepubliceye@gmail.com I wish there were more folks were her gumption in standing up to government agents abusing their badges and authority.
Here is her full comment:
I stumbled upon this site by accident and am glad I did.
I am actually the citizen, who filmed 48 hours of misconduct out my window during police week.
The visiting officers did not have any problem drinking in public, howling, screaming, yelling and playing bagpipes until 2, 3 and 4 am below our window. They were taking open conatiners of beer into the Irish Channel. They were urinating on the church steps across the street and left behind half empties for the homeless, when they staggered back to the hotels.
I also have video, which has not been released, of DC MPD sitting in their cars, standing by their cars, while these guys started a bagpipe parade at 12:45 AM on Tuesday morning. For them, I have close ups of the car numbers and the officer’s faces as much as my camera would allow.
I called a total of 9 times, which I documented with times and which officer answered the phone and sent an email to the Mayor, the City Council Members, Chief Lanier and NBC 4.
Chief Lanier showed up at my door 4 hours later and has thus far, at least tried to show some interest in making positive changes.
In fact, I have been asked to meet with Commander Burke, Commander Groomes, representatives from DCRA (permits), ABRA (Alcohol Regulations) and EMA this week to further address the problem.
I had the video posted on youtube.com. My account was hacked after I received threats from a self identified “DC police Officer” warning me about the size of the “Brotherhood and airing dirty laundry.”
I have started trying to get the video back up and should have it put together again by tomorrow.
I ask that if you have specific complaints about National Police Week, you please forward them to me. I have set up an anonymous e-mail to collect those complaints. As of today, I have 57 pages of comments, complaints and threats.
I have not had much support and in fact do fear for my safety. I signed my name to the complaint to the Chief, and am not 100% certain that information will stay confidential.
Any input, help, support or even a few kind words at this point, would be appreciated.
You can look up the videos on youtube.com by searching Inthepubliceye. The e-mail account is a gmail account using the same name.
Thanks for the forum and for getting some additional information out there. I agree 100% with everthing stated so far regarding the way our government is running. I also learned new information about some of the politics hidden behind NPW. Thanks!
Threats. How typical of these bullies. Apparently the concept that respect must be earned has been erased from our culture.
A friend sent me this link because he knows I attend each year. I am respectful of the laws and I dont act out in public. Until you have served your city, county, or country then you can only play armchair quarterback to what you see. You should move to the red zone in Bagdad if you like a smaller police presence. Your comments and beliefs are some of the most extreme and unamerican garbage I have read in years. I only hope that you are in need of an officer someday while you are on your knees groveling for your life to some street scum. I am really happy that you are up there and I am here in Texas where the citizens appreciate and respect law enforcement officers. Be happy you are in a country that allows spineless people like you and your minions to exist and spread your crap to anyone who will listen to you. Do us all a favor and jump off of a tall bridge.
Did you witness illegal conduct by other police officers during National Police Week?
If so, how did you respond?
It looks like the Inthepubliceye Lady has reposted some video here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LSCTcBItmRA
Sgt. Glock has got the whole fascist cop rhetoric thing down pat – a brilliant parody of an idiot cop. The sad thing is there really are some people out there that think like this. At first I thought he was serious, but you seldom read anything that stupid written by an authentic moron without numerous spelling errors.
He should get a gig at Comedy Central writing for the Colbert Report.
Jim, I just saw one of your police state photos in an article by Chris Floyd here:
http://www.atlanticfreepress.com/content/view/1632/81/
You can always fall back on photojournalism if the empire decides to start banning your books.
I did not observe any officer conducting any illegal activity. I responded by going to Shellys back room and enjoying a single malt and a Arturo Fuete cigar. Do you have the same feeling for our troops who blow off some steam after being in a combat zone, or are you also ready to have them drawn and quartered.
Answer Bovard’s question, “Dave Sgt. Glock.”
There are two kinds of cops. One stands behind his shield, the other hides behind his. Which kind are you, “Dave Sgt. Glock”? (I suspect you’re the latter, by the way.)
Ever hear of Frank Serpico, the quintessential honest cop? The whole New York City P.D. despised him because he liked to see the law applied to–gasp!–cops, too. What’s your take on that, “Dave Sgt. Glock”?
dave sgt glock is the typical pig in the habit of forever reminding us that only he and all other pigs “risk their lives to keep us safe.” As if we are too dumb to know the reason the pigs must keep us safe is because it was pigs who wrote the most letters to the most politicians asking them to disarm us. These low IQ pigs actually believe we don’t know their disarmament tactic has left us without any choice but to depend on these greedy nazis.
Any American in the habit of reminding the public of their alleged chivalry is obviously a coward (spineless). They think we don’t know that this constant reminder is part of their total gun ban tactic to empower only them at our expense. What pigs have done has left most of us less safe and less free – for that we are suppose to be grateful. Only in America (due in part to our cowardly police forces) are cowards labeled heroes.
Pigs (cowards) like dave glock head for the red zone to improve their resumes – yes they take their chances – and after they return from their American Enterprise Institute hit man expeditions they not only hope for better career advancement, but they demand more respect. If they don’t get it then they try to take away our freedom and remind us they went to the red zone for our freedom.
We are supposed to adhere to their advice – but who would bother to listen to a brainwashed puppet that worships their government and encourages it to remove our freedoms.
Obviously if we had our guns we would not need so many of these nazis patrolling the streets of which they have made so unsafe. If we could get at least half of them to quit their jobs we would all be more safe, more free, and have some of our privacy (and peace) too.
Police are muggers, rapists, murderers, drug dealers and terrorists. But worse than that they are the most likely American to go around hustling innocent people out of their civil rights hoping to score a bust to advance their careers. They do all that and actually believe we don’t know. Do us all a favor and find employment in a different field – anything except law enforcement – or just place your glock up against your temple and pull the trigger.
Litmus test to Dave Sgt. Glock: As a fellow and native Texan, please state your position regarding the 2nd Amendment.
Do you agree that the 2nd Amendment should be enforced to the letter, meaning I can buy any firearm I choose whenever I choose without having to file paperwork or seek approval from “wonderful” protectors like yourself? If the answer is “no”, then please resign your badge and take your un-American commie/fascist outlook somewhere else. Perhaps you could follow up on the Bill of Rights and see how that might be applied to your line of work.
It is not Kosher for me carry around a holstered firearm whereever I go, but quiet all right for those with a “badge” and wearing the right uniform.
I don’t believe cops should be randomly assaulted or harmed, but perhaps your job would be “safer” if you would stop enforcing BS laws that do little to enhance public safety. Perhaps stick to the basic stuff like theft, rape, murder, assault and the like? I know we should be wearing our seatbelts and consuming too much mind altering drugs is bad, but could you guys focus on the basics? Again, you might refer to the Bill of Rights of the US Constitution.
When I was a younger male in my 20’s, I always resented it when a traffic stop also turned into whether I may be some sort of drug peddler because I was driving a beat up old car. Either issue me a ticket for alleged offense and move on, or charge me and arrest me before “searching” my car. Your brothers are intimidating at times and these kind of experiences do not enamor me with the role of police in a free society. All I learned from the traffic stops is that we live in Amerika, not America.
Those with some really dangerous jobs that actually do something for society are those who repair the several thousand volt electrical lines in bad weather, running an oil rig out in the Gulf of Mexico, the manual jobs of maintaining a sewer system or refinery or construction, these are the jobs that are truly put one at great personal risk.
I am thankful for those in law enforcement who have come to their senses regarding the “drug war”, but there are more changes in thought that need to occur before we can be free again.
The level and tone of antipathy toward the police in general nullify entirely the value of the reasoned cricitism elsewhere on the site and in the comments. If you give authorities and police such a huge excuse not to listen to stuff they don’t want to hear, they’ll gladly take it and dismiss you as anti-establishment oddballs.
I just remembered: Perhaps an officer of the law could tell me why I am seeing “City of XXX Law Enforcement Center” or “County of XXXX Law Enforcement Center”?
I see this more so in the smaller communities of Texas and find it creepy. What happened to the City Police or County Sheriff? What is with this banana republic militaristic BS of “law enforcement center”?
Dave Sgt. Glock – I am surprised that you did not see any illegal conduct.
I stumbled onto a police week rally by accident and I was surprised by the open contempt for the law – and the swagger by most (not all) of the policemen there.
Did you see any conduct by police officers during National Police Week that would have resulted in a private citizen being ticketed or stopped?
On the “pig” references – I do not agree with this characterization of cops per se.
There are good cops out there. There is an even a law enforcement member affiliate of the NRA – which has actively spoken out against gun control legislation.
The opposite error is to presume that all cops are courageous public servants – and thus that we should ask any questions when they shoot someone who appeared to be innocent.
Americans have been far too deferential to government in recent years, and that attitude has gotten way too many people killed.
Thanks to everyone, who has taken the time to contact me and show your support and concern. I thought I would give you the latest update.
I received an e-mail from the Mayor’s office, which as my beloved father would say, is “a day late and a dollar short.”
He simply attached the letter of apology the Chief sent out to residents, the week prior. As you will read, he passed the buck as if the problem is solved.
Below is my response to his email and the original. I have deleted my signature and such, simply because I do not feel safe putting my name out there for the average patrol officer, when I have such a huge complaint in to DC MPD.
Again, thanks for the support, it helps to know there are at least a few people, who feel the same and want changes made.
————————
Mayor Fenty,
While I acknowledge the time it took you to send the attachment, I received this official letter a week ago. It was handed to me in person, by Commander Diane Groomes.
I beg to differ that it actually addresses any of my concerns. It is in fact a letter of apology, with contact information applying to the week in question, should other problems be noted.
First I want to say, Chief Lanier has responded in a way, which has gone above my expectations. She was at my front door within four hours of my e-mail being sent.
I cannot say I am as impressed with the response from your office, from Tommy Wells our Ward 6 representative or other Council members.
As of today, the only Council member to take the time to respond personally to me has been Councilwoman Mary Cheh. And I received a phone call from Councilman Jim Graham’s office to “confirm my address.”
I am actively working with Chief Lanier, Commander Burke, Commander Groomes, representatives from DCRA, ABRA and EMA as well as Charley Docter from ANC 6C09. The ultimate objective is to make the concerns heard, to actively seek change and vigorously engage in forcing those changes.
While the apology is an excellent start, there needs to be substantial change created. Currently the way our DC Officers obviously deal with visiting Officers, when there are issues and complaints from the citizens of DC, is completely unacceptable. Had a DC resident, or even a crowd of residents exhibited the behavior shown on the video, the DC MPD response would have been much different.
As residents we have heard Chief Ramsey in the past tell us he “was going to resolve the problem.” I have copies of emails stating he would send out letters to the participating jurisdictions and how he would change the DC MPD response to the event. As of this previous week, we can say, his words and actions were “thick smoke and mirrors to appease the residents for another year.”
Chief Lanier has assured me, she wants to actually fix the problem, so that future events do not have the same outcome as this year or previous years. We are now putting our faith and trust in Chief Lanier, as she has shown a different public response than Chief Ramsey ever did while holding his office.
I feel Chief Lanier tried to send a strong message by apologizing to the residents and handing out the flyers to remind the visiting Officers of our DC laws. I strongly believe she has been the most genuine in addressing the concerns, and has placed her Commanders at the table to try and actually do something for us, the taxpayers.
As your office is fully aware, and as every Council member is fully aware, this is not the first complaint filed about this issue. It takes place every year. I assume this is just the first year it was actually videotaped.
My expectation is your Office and every Council member will fully and without hesitation support Chief Lanier’s efforts in creating the needed changes. My expectation is that DCRA, ABRA and EMA fully support and actively work with Chief Lanier and her Commanders to resolve this perennial problem.
The public trust has been broken for an extended time, when it comes to our city government. It is up to you, as the Mayor to adjust the tempo for change, and support those within the various departments to make those changes in order to restore the public trust.
My expectation is you will live up to the promises you made to secure the office you hold.
The question at hand is: Will you?
Sincerely,
(Name and Address Withheld on Public Forums due to threats)
—–Original Message—–
Sent: Tuesday, May 22, 2007 10:13 AM
Subject: Email from the EOM
(Name Withheld)
Thank you so much for writing me about your concerns around Police Week. Attached you will find a letter from Chief Lanier which addresses your concerns.
Sincerely,
Adrian Fenty
Mayor
———————-
Judge for yourself, as to how his response dealt with a police response complaint from a citizen.
I do think the new Chief is actually trying to clean things up, and I noticed as she makes changes in some of the commands, (demoted a commander) lawsuits from those chnages are starting to happen.
Basically, those Officers, who do not like the changes she is making will file a lawsuit against her and the city, which I think will make the city back down. However, if we were to sue the individual officers for NOT doing the job they are paid to do, we would be considered Un-American, and given threats of “not being there as you beg for your life.”
I will post more as the situation evolves.
InThePublicEye
“I did not observe any officer conducting any illegal activity. I responded by going to Shellys back room and enjoying a single malt and a Arturo Fuete cigar. Do you have the same feeling for our troops who blow off some steam after being in a combat zone, or are you also ready to have them drawn and quartered.”
Are you actually making the comparison of a job in law enforcement in the united states to that of a soldier in a combat zone? Give us a break, you whining soggy bully– your job isn’t that dangerous– in fact it’s not even one of the top 10 most dangerous.
As a matter of fact I am a life member in the NRA and I shoot in competitions all over the United States. I am a industry sponsered shooter in USPSA and a hard core supporter of the 2nd amendment. I also teach civilian Concealed Handgun classes and support an armed public.
For the rest of you Rosie O’donnel wanna be’s you can direct your hatred toward someone who gives you credibility. I sleep well every night with the knowlege that I am trying to make a difference. I do not tolerate “dirty” cops or people who abuse their authority any any profession for those who care about my side.
I note that “Dave Sgt. Glock” did not answer my question, “Did you see any conduct by police officers during National Police Week that would have resulted in a private citizen being ticketed or stopped?”
Sgt. Glock appears to believe that all such reports are slanders upon the police – though I’m not sure if that is a fair characterization of his view.
Jim – I think he did respond. He was in a back room, drinking and smoking, and so saw nothing. A picture of struthiousity, as it were, since if he saw nothing, it therefore did not happen.
Sgt. Glock:
I think you owe Jim an answer to a very pertinent question that he asked: “Did you see any conduct by police officers during National Police Week that would have resulted in a private citizen being ticketed or stopped?”
For myself, I wonder: do you believe that citizens who file complaints on their police departments should get a useful response? Or maybe you think that complaints should not be permitted?
Do you believe that it is appropriate for such citizens to receive threats from policemen? Do you understand how such behavior can affect the esteem in which the affected department is held, or do you believe that citizens should mindlessly support the department regardless of conduct?
I think that you don’t understand that it is your sneering, snotty attitude toward us mere citizens that causes us to dislike and distrust you.
InThePublicEye, the D.C. authorities are giving you the usual blow-off crap. You can’t expect anything else from them.
This Dave Sgt. Glock (assuming he’s really a cop)
ought to take his Glock and stuff it up his ass
To Jim,
I did not take notice of anyone breaking any laws while I was in D.C. I did not go to the parties at night. I opted to go eat a nice dinner with my wife each night. I have no problem with citizen complaints. If you are doing your job correctly you will receive a complaint every now and then. I have testified before Internal affairs against a command staff officer that used racial comments and he was demoted for it. I caught a bunch of shit for it by some other officers but I didnt care.
I realize I am in your domain now and it is easy for all of you to pile on so I dont let it bug me. Mr. Carter is more than welcome to come down here and attemp to stuff my Glock up my ass. The last thing that I will be intimidated by is a chairborne ranger, keyboard commando like him. You are a Douche bag to the fullest extent.
So he supports an armed public and a hardcore supporter of the 2nd Amendment. That is good news, does this mean I can own a 50 caliber machine gun? How about an AK-47? Does this mean I can buy a handgun and carry it whereever a private property owner does not mind or inside a police station or any public building I pay taxes to support without a badge? How hardcore are you? The NRA is a group of lame woosies; hardly worthy protectors of the 2nd Amendment.
There are no “Rosie O’Donnells” at this blog. Just concerned citizens that realize that government has become to big and is out of control.
He says he complies with all laws. So he is for enforcing the Bill of Rights to the letter? I did not really see a straight answer.
To Sgt Glock — I appreciate the response to my question.
If there are other police who want to comment here, they are welcome to post. Obviously, folks don’t need to agree with him in order to add their two cents here.
To Don,
I think if you are a citizen of legal age and clean background you should be able to carry a weapon just about anywhere you want. I understand not letting guns into courtrooms because of the emotional state of people in attendance. My dad bought me my first rifle when I was 8, and my first shotgun at 13, so I have been around firearms long before I joined my department in 1984. I own an AK-47 along with many AR-15’s and a class III licensed suppressor for a 9mm Glock and a 9mm AR carbine. The carbine has a licensed SBR as well. I dont always agree with everything the NRA does, but they are the best we have at this time. If another group of 2nd amendment lobbyist emerge and can prove to do a better job then I will join them. I also have a .50 BMG rifle in the future plans so dont paint me as a wanna be gun grabbing bureaucrat that wants a disarmed society. It didnt work for Hitler and it hopefully will backfire on Hugo Chaves.
Donate some cash to Congressman Ron Paul’s campaign.
The NRA has done some excellent work.
They also have done some things that made me cringe, like back an opponent against Rep. Ron Paul (R-Tx), the most pro-Constitution member of Congress.
The Gun Owners of America are more fervent and more hardline on some issues than the NRA. They have done some excellent activist work in DC and elsewhere.
One concern I have about pro-gun groups is that they sometimes view the Second Amendment as an island. But if the waters of arbitrary power continue rising – if the Fourth Amendment is shredded, and due process is vanished – that island of gun rights is going under.
“One concern I have about pro-gun groups is that they sometimes view the Second Amendment as an island.”
I could live with that. It’s the swarms of gunowners who are willing to sell out other amendments – or worse, other firearms than the ones they favor – that concern me. And I include a majority of police (not to mention lawyers) in that assessment, unfortunately.
Ben Franklin’s bit about “hanging together or hanging separately” is as appropriate today as it was two centuries ago.
I’ll give Mr. Block some credit for limiting guns in a courtroom, but overall I dislike the double standard.
I am concerned that there was no outcry at the gun seizure in New Orleans of law abiding citizens defending their property; another sad day for the amount of freedom we really have in this country.
Don’t forget Jews for the Preservation of Firearms Ownership.
http://www.jpfo.org
JPFO is a fine group – thanks for adding the link to their website.
I agree on the gun seizure in New Orleans. I think the NRA may have done something on that, though I don’t recall how timely it was.
Tom Blanton – belated thanks for the kind words on the photo and the link to that photo being used at Atlantic Free Press. I didn’t know that anyone had picked up on those photos.
Playing with the camera is fun in part because it forces my mind to focus on something aside from this damn computer monitor.
And even a little compact digital can be enough to make mischief with….
Police are the worst Americans. They have too much power.
The law that makes killing a cop punishable by death must be eliminated. The law allowing retired police to carry a concealed firearm must be eliminated.
Citizens who attack police, in self defense, and when probable cause was not present, should never be arrested by any member of that police department. Once a citizen claims self defense then only county police can have jurisdiction. Local police departments should be outlawed anyway.
When police are accused of crime, by a citizen, or against another citizen then another government entity must investigate.
It should be a felony offense for any police officer to confiscate a citizens firearm or personal weapon. Only a judge should be allowed to order this confiscation.
Police chiefs should not be allowed to speak to any member of the news media.
Drug raids on personal residences must be eliminated completely before any more innocent citizens are harmed. Police dogs should be banned completely. Armored vehicles should be prohibited too.
Police should be declared public enemy number one.
The NRA should stop and ban completely any police training programs. Police only shooting competitions should be banned. Some of the best weapons for self defense have been outlawed because of police (sawed-off shotguns, handguns, switchblades, etc.) A switchblade is one of the best weapons to protect yourself from police attack.
All during our history liberals have used economic crises as an excuse to trample liberty. Conservatives use immorality as an excuse to trample liberty. Libertarians have never stopped or slowed the steady erosion of liberty in America. Police (government employees) are connected to liberals. Liberal is a politically correct name for a socialist. Most socialists are nazis.
To win the war on terror all we need do is vacate the Middle East. There are enough liberals and conservatives who don’t want to win the war on terror.
“Insofar as the government takes from the citizen more than it renders to the citizen, the citizen owes the state the same contempt that he would have for any other con-artist ((police)).” [J.B., Freedom Daily]
I would like to try to take this discussion in a different direction.
While I agree that it is hypocritical for some police, such as those depicted in the video, to enforce laws designed to combat drunkenness and disorderly conduct against the general public (i.e. civilians) and not hold their fellow officers to the same standard I believe that possibly it is the law and not the lawbreaker that is most at fault here.
Why should there be “open container” laws? Just like in the many cases cited by those in favor of unrestricted gun ownership, why should the activity of all be restricted when the vast majority would act in a responsible fashion while walking down the street and consuming alcoholic beverages.
I think the answer relates to the urge of legislators (albeit as the behest of constituents) to misuse their law-making power. By that I mean that at one time that activity was tolerated and, as a result, that liberty was not abused by the vast majority of citizens.
However, alcoholics or problem drinkers walking down the street, intoxicated and unruly, caused the populace to want to find a way to stop the offending behavior. Or, as is often the case, the law was used to round up the “wrong element” when they happened to wander into a “nice” neighborhood on the way back to their hovels. As a result, everyone lost a bit of their precious liberty… a long time ago.
As the conservatives oft like to cite, why not enforce the laws on the books rather than make new ones? I’m sure there were laws that covered loud and obnoxious behavior and if they had been enforced fairly and consistently, then liberty could be preserved as well as public order.
These police officers are not suddenly evil people just because they want to blow off some steam and engage in celebratory behavior.
The problem comes when we become a country of men (people) and not of laws. The ordinary citizens are arrested, however, the protected groups can engage in illegal behavior because they have the power.
This is only one example, but it has not seeped into every aspect of American jurisprudence to the extent that we have a president who ignores laws he finds inconvenient, people in positions of unchallenged integrity abusing those under their care, and the most powerful country in the history of the world invading other sovereign nations, subjugating and murdering their citizens in the hundreds of thousands.
We live in a diverse country and among a diverse collection of cultures and moral codes. In such a heterogeneous mix, it would be very difficult to find anything in common. However, I believe and have said for years that there is one thing that all people on this planet understand and nearly universally condemn.
That is a shared disgust for hypocrisy. That is the sin of those in power using their authority to flout the laws themselves while, at the same time, enforcing those laws against others.
That’s just my opinion, I may be wrong.
I agree with you on the hypocrisy.
I also agree on the laws banning open containers of alcohol. If someone is merely drinking a beer in public, that doesn’t make him the equivalent of a kidnapper. Beer doesn’t become a weapon of mass destruction merely because someone is drinking it sitting on their front steps. (DC was famous for arresting people for this crime a few years ago – one of their biggest BS crackdowns).
I think most of the concern of complaints about National Police Week was not the open containers but the behavior joined to it.
“These police officers are not suddenly evil people just because they want to blow off some steam and engage in celebratory behavior.”
Police have been made a higher, separate class of citizen. After Prohibition the emphasis (for gun bans) was to keep the public safe; today the emphasis is to keep police safe ! Every excuse to keep the public safe is being used (created) to ensure the safety of police. And what it does is make the public less safe and less free.
Police memorials are being forced on the public’s domain. What is a national police memorial doing in Red Square, D.C. ? The newsmedia refers to everyone of them as heroes – at great expense to the rights of the public. Streets are blocked off for police events. We are no longer considered innocent until proven guilty – we are guilty if police say we are. Meanwhile police are caught robbing, raping, selling drugs and murdering – it’s like the dogma used by gun bashers and the dogma used by war hawk and socialist politicians – it’s the opposite of the truth.
In Ohio while Conceal/carry was debated in the legislature, police wanted a provision requiring the public to inform police if they were carrying, as if criminals would comply; and what about the individual’s safety from a cop intent on assasinating him; it removed the ability to protect oneself from a rogue cop. The assumption is always that police would never harm you or us. But who was it that disarmed citizens at New Orleans after Katrina. The other assumption is that police never commit crime. All the efforts to keep the public safe have made us less safe, less free and have made police more safe and more free than the public.
Make government your servant not your master.
I may have reacted out of anger intitially at Jim, but now that I have researched some of his writings I feel he has some good points. I do not agree with everything he believes in but that is what makes our country great.
Saturdaynight-you really need some F’ing professional help. I am not even going to lower myself by responding to your BS.
…Government, or Machiavelli’s prescient definition of The State, i.e they are either Republics or Monarchies; are in their effect on the Governed what George Washington characterized them as. The final arbiter of “Force.”
Thomas Jefferson succinctly addressed the why of this actuality in an 1800 Report on The State of Virginia. wherein he defines the essential paradigm that drives The Realpolitik; both Foreign and Domestic: “If once the people become inattentive to Public Affairs, you and I and Congress and Assemblies, Judges and Governors shall all become Wolves. It seems to be the law of our general nature in spite of individual exceptions.”
Reality thus being what it is. I would admonish Sgt. Glock that Wolves, like men both exist within Hierarchical Societies.
agree with your point that the police, “have been made a higher, separate class of citizen” and IMHO there are good as well as bad aspects to that. While all persons should not be prejudged and be allowed to show what kind of person they are before an opinion is formed, by that same token, they cannot and should not be condemned as a group.
I have always been troubled by the idea that there should be separate laws governing assaults on law enforcement people and ordinary citizens. However, I think society is making a point that those that they expect to enforce the laws should be given civic support, in the same way that first responders and firefighters are accorded respect for the difficult and often heroic jobs they perform.
That said, I remember when the FDNY was honored in Madison Square Garden for their work and that of their fallen comrades after the attack on the WTC. The first lady of the US showed up on stage and they booed her. I thought to myself, for heroes these guys are acting like boorish thugs. That’s because every person is a mixture of good and bad characteristics, so they cannot be immediately condemned nor canonized due to their station or occupation.
I will be perfectly frank, as I get older I have more of tendency to think of cops not as the “thin blue line that separates anarchy and civilization” but a bunch of bad ass people who simply work to protect the elite and keep everyone else in line. I’m sure the truth lies somewhere in between.
I think everyone can agree that they have a tough job and are asked to get involved in things (like domestic disturbances) that they have neither the training nor the temperament to handle. Plus, think about it this way – if nearly every time you interacted with the general citizenry, you saw anger and violence with a good measure directed at you just because you’re a police officer, that’s bound to mess with your head.
So, they retreat to the safety of those who understand even more than their wives (or husbands) and families – their compatriots on the force. They watch their back and visa-versa. It’s a vicious circle.
However, I have no patience with cops wining about the fact that they need more firepower or be given leave to do whatever they judge necessary to keep what they perceive as the peace. If a police officer goes to work scared every day then I say he should be fired so he can get a more appropriate job. In addition, you have the factor of those who actually want the power and enjoy lording it over their fellow citizens.
They shouldn’t get on the force in the first place.
…To presuppose there is more than touch of Inherent Sadism within every Police Officers personalty; is as reliable an instinct as a Bad Hangover being the price of a Good Drunk. I would know about both.
Dave Sgt. Glock – I appreciate you taking the time to track down some of my writings.
I don’t agree that all cops are sadistic or merely seek the prerogative to oppress private citizens. I have dealt with some good cops in my time and I don’t forget ’em.
I think that as Congress and state legislatures enact more malum prohibitum laws (things that are banned merely because politicians say so, not because they are bad in themselves) that this is changing how police interact with the public. Mandatory seatbelt laws are a good example. Wearing seatbelts is usually prudent but to make not wearing them a crime generates far more antagonism between police & citizens. That famous Supreme Court case a few years ago where a mother was arrested because her kids did not have on their seatbelts exemplifies this nonsense.
The massive federal funding for the militarization of local police is also changing how police interact with average Americans.
Jim:
Good for you for cutting Dave Sgt. Glock some slack concerning his eventual answer to your question.
However, I did notice he said, “I did not take notice of anyone breaking any laws”.
Now I don’t know about you, but I see the phrase “did not take notice” as a code word for “ignored”. It expresses, IMHO, a willingness to not see.
Maybe I’m being too strict and I hope Dave will clarify. If I am wrong, I gladly apologize to Dave.
quote:
“…Saturdaynight-you really need some F’ing professional help. I am not even going to lower myself by responding to your BS.”
Glock: you’re about as low as anyone can get. Just another punk wanna be. You came here to smell the crotch of libertarians. Quit law enforcement and take up waitressing – you’ll be safer then. I can easily shove that cigar down your throat – pig.
…Given the viciousness of the element they deal with on a daily basis, it’s one thing for Police Officers to enjoy the exercise of authority as well as its occasional qualified abuse. But quite another to give it a cynical free reign. After 12 years of swimming in these same polluted waters [Security Guard] I came away with an enormous sense of ambivalence regarding the Cops…In the end I can take ’em, or leave ’em. And I’m certain most would feel the same about me.
Dave Sgt Glock –
If you are not a parody/satire, then I think you are a pathetic piece of coprolitic detritus. Your attitudes presented in your various posts are condescending, and reek of a sense of superiority that extends to a right to extinguish another’s life. You are no libertarian, sir. You wrap your bloodlust in a flag, and in a pledge to liberty, but you really seek to control others and injure or kill those with whom you do not safely agree. Your supposed respect for the right to disagree is narrow, you charlatan. You have repeatedly made statements cheering on the injury and murder of other humans.
You are, in a word, pathetically neandertal.
And if you are a parody/satire, you’re an unfortunately unfunny one.
…By Neanderthal he means a Caveman with a club. Like Alley-Oop in the old funny papers.
It is my not so humble opinion that because we place law enforcement officers in a position of authority over the rest of us, that they should be held to a much higher standard of behavior. No cop should be allowed to commit what would be a “criminal” act if committed by an ordinary citizen, no matter the reason (including “sting” operations). Further, all cops should be required to treat every citizen, even one they are arresting, with courtesy (unless that person is actively attacking them). No knock raids should be outlawed, then no innocent person would have a legitimate reason to shoot at them. They should also not be allowed to shoot family pets under any circumstances, one of those pole/loop jobbies that animal control uses would suffice to prevent a family pet from attacking police in defense of its family; killing the animal is not necessary, and is downright cruel whether the arrestee is innocent or guilty, especially if children are present. I have no problem with police tracking dogs, I do however have a problem with police attack dogs, if anything in this world should be banned, police attack dogs are one. I would much prefer it if the police would stick to enforcing the laws against doing physical harm to another or another’s property and leave the vices (drugs, prostitution, gambling, smoking, drinking in public, etc.) out of the picture. Making criminals out of (formerly law abiding) people who have a vice that has fallen out of favor with politicians is just plain wrong and the police should not stoop to enforcing those ridiculous “moral” laws.
..I should have a Cuban cigar, a Voluptuous young blonde on each arm of an expensive dinner jacket too…But I don’t.
Mace – a good cigar and a fine pair sounds like a great start – but why ruin it by wearing formalwear?
Mace, you’re right — but Alley Oop was a good bit more thoughtful and clever than Mr Glock-head.